kore_logs | Would you please forgive me? For while I cannot love myself, I'll use something else.

Entry tags:

Would you please forgive me? For while I cannot love myself, I'll use something else.

Who: Castiel and OPEN
Where: Near the bar
When: day 47
What: Gettin' drunk, bein' pissy
Warnings: Other than drinking, probably none, but it may depend on the thread.

Castiel had been worried enough about Lucifer and then Crowley when he'd only had Meg to worry about. Now that Dean was back, he was even more concerned. Dean could hold his own against a lot of powerful creatures, but Lucifer was a whole new level and Crowley wasn't exactly easy to pick off. They needed to plan some sort of defensive strategy.

He'd gone looking for Dean in the obvious location. Before, Dean had spent a good deal of his time in the bar and so Castiel had gone there to find him. Finding the bar empty, he had gone for what he recognized to be one of Dean's favored drinks. Surely, he only had to wait and Dean would show up eventually. It was easier than running all over the town where Crowley might spot him. There were easier ways to locate Dean, but maybe Castiel wanted to nurse a little self-pity. Balthazar and Sam were still missing and Dean was... well, he was better, but he was different and he didn't remember. What if they kept making him forget?

Several hours later, he found himself leaving the bar alone. He wasn't as drunk as he'd been in the past, but he would be lying if he said he wasn't feeling it.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Castiel couldn't allow the world to end--he wouldn't--not after what the Winchesters had gone through and not while the world was still their Father's beautiful creation. Humans were flawed, but no more flawed than angels. He didn't know why the other couldn't see that.

"No, you only pretend to be. You speak for yourself. You don't care what He wants any more than you care what I want." He shook his head. "I loved Michael once, too, but I can't stand back and let either of you destroy everything He left to us."

Raphael didn't understand how Castiel could rank the Winchesters as being that important - they were nothing, no one, two humans with very short lives against everything else. It made no sense to him, to use them as the value of measure when there was so much else wrong.

"I pretend nothing. God's Will is Heaven's will, and as I'm the one left in charge..." And that might change, but only at his death. "You'd let all of humanity suffer, and why? Because it's what a few want?" God abandoned and betrayed them - He no longer had a say.

The Winchesters were friends and that had become everything to Castiel, even moreso after he'd betrayed them and started to understand where his own choices had been wrong.

"Humanity isn't suffering, Raphael. It's surviving." The bad survived just as much as the good, but the good still counted. It still mattered. "What makes us any more worthy than they are?"

Raphael flat out stared at Castiel. He could have suddenly sprouted greeting card fluffy wings, the look would have been about the same.

"Surviving, Castiel? Millions starve to death each day, die from lack of drinking water, from illness - nothing which they couldn't manage, if they tried, if hunters hadn't wiped out so many of the species which prey on them. Instead they wage war on each other for population control. How many have there been in the last century alone? And it's only going to get worse. Dean broke the first Seal, Castiel - look what even the righteous are willing to do. They are suffering, they are in pain. Leaving them to flounder? It's cruelty."

"I don't leave them to flounder. I've been traveling. I've been helping people... healing them and fixing things. There are bad people out there, but there are good people, too." He wasn't sure why he was even trying. Raphael refused to see what Castiel saw in their Father's creations.

Yes, Dean had broken the first seal and Castiel had done far worse than that, but he couldn't believe that atonement was impossible. Dean had forgiven him and surely his Father, in all of His infinite love and mercy could forgive them, that is if He even cared at all.

"I'm working to make amends for my mistakes. I can only hope that you don't think I'm the only one who has made them." He didn't mean just Raphael, either. Who among them hadn't made mistakes?

"Heaven if full of good people Castiel. I well know they exist. My point is that they are suffering - and there is nothing you will ever be able to do to stop that." Raphael sounded almost as sorrowful as he was frustrated. Castiel wasn't hearing him, or Raphael suspected he simply didn't want to understand.

Good people where driven to do horrible things because they were alone and suffering - Raphael had wanted to to end that. He still did.

"How much work can you do Castiel? For every one you help - how many still cry out in pain or fear? Those that you save, does it ever even out the bloodshed you've caused?" It was harsh, yes, and would have been harsher had Raphael known the future - but he really isn't attempting to be cruel. Something that might also have changed if he knew the future. "Mistakes are something that lead to that kind of suffering."

He had made his mistakes - missteps - but the younger angels stumbled most. It was why he did what he did. Trying to protect them from minor and major falls.

No. No, Castiel could never make up for what he's done and he knew as much. He'd caused so much suffering and he wasn't good, but he didn't see things in the same absolute black and white that he once had. He wasn't bad, either. He was simply guilty of sins, like everyone else.

"We should still have the freedom to make those mistakes and learn from them." Despite his wrong choices, he wouldn't give up his seeming autonomy for anything. He couldn't do it, knowing what he knew and experiencing what he had. Nothing Raphael could say would change that. "Suffering is part of life. It's how we grow. I think He always intended that."

Raphael would never forgive Castiel for what he'd done - and those were simply for the things he knew. He was more likely to forgive Lucifer for being the one who ripped the archangels apart to begin with.

"You speak of freedom Castiel - but you know angels aren't built for it. You'd bring cruelty down on the heads of your siblings for no other reason that to see them fall and suffer as you have. Because you believe it's what you should do." Which made him no different than Lucifer - or Raphael and Michael.

Raphael's jaw ticked at the mention of their long absent Father. "He has a voice. If He refuses to speak, then those of us made to lead should - and we do."

"I know now that not all of them want it." He really did think that he understood what had gone wrong and where. "But why would you take freedom away from those who want it? I'm not the only one. You wouldn't let me leave."

He knew he couldn't blame everything on Raphael. He knew exactly what had been his fault and the guilt ate at him, but he wouldn't take all of the responsibility. He hadn't been the only one to make mistakes.

"I don't deny my mistakes. There is so much I regret that I would do differently, but leaving wasn't a mistake and I don't regret it." His actions, misguided as they'd been, had been actions of love when they had started.

Raphael actually blinked slowly at Castiel. "Most - the vast majority - don't. They are following you because God raised you. Because they think you have answers. They have no understanding of what free will is."

He didn't yet know Balthazar had run off - in his experience, those who had run off where cowards or had questioned too much, been crushed under the weight of doubt. "No, I wasn't going to let you leave. Heaven forbid I prefer my brothers in Heaven where they belong."

Raphael could point out everything that was wrong with Castiel leaving. "Leaving was a mistake Castiel." Instead he left it there.

"You're right." He paused. "About them, you are right. Most of them followed me for the wrong reasons and I let them because I thought winning was worth it, but it wasn't." Not that he knew where to even start on any sort of alternative. He'd been so desperate and he'd let that control him.

"I don't think you're right about me, though." He'd changed. So much had changed and he did belong in Heaven, but not a corrupt one. "Do you still think I belong there?"

"If you recall, I've explained that before, although you refused to listen." Raphael had known it would end badly - he had been trying to save his brothers, even if a few disagreed.

"If I didn't, you wouldn't still be alive." Or at least, would have died again. He wouldn't have offered Castiel a chance to return if he didn't believe his brother belonged there. "And no, I'm not."

Something in Castiel's face softened. He didn't think he belonged in Heaven--he didn't even deserve to be welcome there--but if Raphael thought he did, well, that could mean something.

"I don't want to fight anymore." He was so tired of fighting. He'd given up in Purgatory and being here had reignited something in him. There were people here worth fighting for and he would if he had to, but he didn't want to.

Here, there was no apocalypse to prevent, no world to save. It was pointless and he couldn't.

Raphael wouldn't cast out any angel who wanted to return to Heaven, not now, and he wasn't sure he wanted his siblings anywhere else. Earth had cost him so many.

He cocked his head, not quite as expressive as Castiel's headtilts but the gesture none the less. "What caused to you believe I did?" If Castiel was this tired of it after only a few years, added thousands onto it, along with all the other burdens Raphael had been carrying. "Did you believe I wanted any of this?"

The Apocalypse was only the means to an end - The End, yes but an end to the struggle.

Castiel looked at Raphael--really looked--and his eyes were glazed over. He looked miserable. "Do you truly believe that I would fight for something if I didn't believe in it?"

He didn't want to fight, but if it meant the Earth was safe, he would keep fighting. Some things were worth that pain.

"Beliefs can be misguided Castiel." Such as Michael's belief that their Father was ever going to return.

"I have nothing else to do. I just want the suffering to be over." Intoxicated or not, perhaps this time Castiel would listen to what Raphael was saying.

"That's what I want, too. I just don't see suffering in all the places you do." It shouldn't be worth tearing their family apart, but it was if Raphael was still so intent on ending the world.

"I only see it right here and that's the suffering I want to end the most." He didn't want to hurt Raphael. He hadn't wanted any of this pain.

"Do you love them? More than just as duty?" 'Them' being humanity - he suspected Castiel was one of the few who did.

It probably speaks highly to how worn Raphael is, and how much he had really wanted Castiel to return that he was allowing it to show at all. But he doesn't reply to it - because he can't voice what it is that is weighing most heavily on him at the moment.

"Nothing about my love has ever been about duty." Not even his love for Raphael or Michael was wholly about duty. He loved them because he simply did, not because he had to. "My love for them, least of all."

He loved humanity because they were beautiful and because free will was something to be cherished, bad choices and all. He loved individuals because they were strong and good and fought for what they believed to be right, sacrificing everything they had and everything they were for it. Most of all, he loved Dean for these reasons, but he saw many of the same qualities in Raphael, too.

"Then imagine hundreds of years, thousands, more. Of watching them fail and fall and knowing nothing you will do will ever actually help them. Watch them slaughter each other, main each other, hear their voices cry out for you again and again. Watch and see the few who are truly wicked destroy so many of those who are good, see those who are good become evil because they just don't know what else to do - and then Castiel, look at all of them and tell me that you think that is what God wants for them." Raphael didn't. He simply could reconcile something created with such importance that it was worth what God had ordered done to Lucifer, worth the pain it was causing Michael, worth them who had grown and lived at His feet, with the neglect he saw in their care. Couldn't look kindly on something that had so much promise waste so much of it. He was disappointed in humanity, and felt that they, like the Host, had been abandoned by their Creator. And he didn't know what else to do for them.

"Imagine what we can do, brother, for the good ones and even the okay ones if we stop watching and start trying to make their lives better. Imagine how good it can be if we make the suffering worth it." He was almost choking on how emotional this conversation made him feel.

"Because some suffering is important and it is worth it. It makes us who we are. What I've learned through my pain isn't something I'd give up, even if I would do things differently now."

"How do we do that, Castiel? Either we have to help everyone - and in that case, what you love, their free will? They will suppress that nature in attempts to appease us." He sighed. He'd see it happen. "Or else we do nothing more than pick favorites. And allow others to suffer unjustly."

Raphael didn't know how - or if it was possible - for them to nudge humanity back onto track without breaking everything they were, or creating a class of humans loved and favored by the Host and those who were just left to fall.

"I understand pain is necessary, Castiel. Setting broken bone or removing cancerous tissue hurts, but it's what must be done - I understand it far better than most. But this...this is far more than that."

"I don't know." He wouldn't pretend that he had all the answers, because he had very few of them. "I'm still figuring it out, but I wish that you would figure it out with me instead of giving up on them. They're worth it, brother. All of this is worth it."

He didn't know how he could show Raphael what he'd seen, because it was so specific and personal. All he could really do is hope that he could find a human here who can get through to Raphael where Castiel's words couldn't.

There were things that needed fixing, but not everything. You didn't amputate before assessing what else could be done to save a limb.

Raphael closed his eyes, chin lowering to his chest, shoulders dropping just slightly. His jaw was tightly clenched, and the inner corner muscles of his eyes squeezed tightly. "No, it's not. No matter what we manage to do...it's not been worth the cost."

He'd always had Michael to lean on, and Zachariah later. Castiel's pet humans had taken both from him, and for that alone he'll never forgive the Winchesters. He'd hoped once he would be able to push Castiel into that role - perhaps he still did. His younger brother seemed to understand things the other angels didn't, and had felt burdens Michael and he had shielded the others from. Raphael couldn't understand why Castiel was the new favored son, but he was, beyond doubt. And while he felt jealousy over that, it wasn't for him.

But that meant something didn't it? The supposed favored sons ruled.

Maybe that was why he was allowing Castiel to see him now.

Edited 2013-04-08 10:00 (UTC)

Castiel no long believed that he was favored. He believed he was being punished, but that was his own cross to bear.

"Maybe you're right. Maybe it isn't, but it doesn't matter. We can't undo anything." They could try to move forward, though. Castiel wanted that desperately. Neither of them could forgive or forget, but if they could just move on, maybe they could find a middle ground. Maybe that was what their Father had wanted all along.

"For now, we're here, anyway." He paused, trying to find the right words that wouldn't be a surrender. "It's peaceful here, in its way."

Would you please forgive me? For while I cannot love myself, I'll use something else.

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

(no subject)

(no subject)

(no subject)

(no subject)